CTC Review: 2010 Kia Forte Koup

[CD_Editor]

Day 1:

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As one would expect, I know most of the options, pricing and features of most cars; it's a part of the job kind of thing.  Obviously, when new cars come out I may not know everything about it, but typically a lot of content is carried forward from previous-generation vehicles or siblings in a manufacturer's lineup, so even then I have some inkling of what to expect in a car for a set price.  For me, the Kia Forte Koup is a complete mystery; I know nothing about it; I have driven it for a day now and am starting to form some opinions of it. Upon sitting down to investigate features and price point, I'm a little shocked!  More...

[rrocket]

Interested to see this one...

[Snowdog]

I am interested in a Hatchback version (possibly next year) of this, but I have been reading a lot complaints about grabby clutch and abrubt throttle tip making for ungraceful launches.

Thoughts?

[wing]

snowdog -- BANG FREAKIN' on.

I NEVER stall a car, I stalled the Forte 4 times already.  I either have to slip the clutch and rev like crazy or be REALLY careful with it -- something doesn't seem right.  The throttle is touchy making it hard to get a smooth transition and the clutch is unpredictable.

[rrocket]

Sounds like driver error to me........

[wing]

Yeah maybe I should settle for an Auto

[Ontariodriver]

Just ride the clutch a bit more.

[wing]

Yes that works, but it sucks.  I thought it was just this car, perhaps someone killed the clutch on it -- but from snowdog's post it sounds almost normal.  Obviously I have driven 100's of different manual transmission cars, this one just doesn't feel quite right.

Heck yesterday it stalled and I was MOVING! ZAH?

[Ontariodriver]

Yes that works, but it sucks.  I thought it was just this car, perhaps someone killed the clutch on it -- but from snowdog's post it sounds almost normal.  Obviously I have driven 100's of different manual transmission cars, this one just doesn't feel quite right.

Heck yesterday it stalled and I was MOVING! ZAH?

There must be a biting point. Ride the clutch to find where it is. You should be able to, just hold the car and slightly let of the clutch. The car should rolled forwards just a tiny bit and gentle push in the clutch and rev's should rise slightly. Shouldn't take you long to find the sweet spot....

[wing]

Dude, you make it sound like I have never driven a manual before

I did this, I can ride the clutch all day long and rock the car back and forth.  The throttle tip in is abrupt, so you either burn the thing and ride it through the intersection or you stall because you don't want to do that.  Or you drive like a granny.

Something is a miss as snowdog pointed out, other journalists have reported the same.

EDIT: quick google comes up with carconnection saying:
 We actually recommend the automatic with the Forte, as it works well with the engine, and clutch-throttle coordination on manual cars was frustrating.

Or how about owners taking a month to get use to it? http://www.kia-world.net/forum/showthread.php?tid=1432&page=2

Really usually it takes 2 starts to get use to a clutch.

[Ontariodriver]

Dude, you make it sound like I have never driven a manual before

PS...Well you're a Canadian It is to be expected. 8 - P

I did this, I can ride the clutch all day long and rock the car back and forth.  The throttle tip in is abrupt, so you either burn the thing and ride it through the intersection or you stall because you don't want to do that.  Or you drive like a granny.

Something is a miss as snowdog pointed out, other journalists have reported the same.

No, Some clutches require learning a new biting point. Not all clutches operate the same. That was my original thinking. But I guess not.

LOL You've never try a MK1 Golf have you? Talk about hard. The clutch pedal had a very high release point. So was tricky at first. Oh well never mind....My Bag.

[wing]

Another quote from another find:
Blame goes to a most unfortunate combination of an unforgiving clutch and an oversensitive throttle that will send the car either zooming forward or stalling out when it's time to move.

I've never had a problem adjusting to a clutch after a few minutes of driving.  Haven't driven an MK1 golf but the MK4 or MK3 I drove (forget which) had a high clutch point as well that was a little odd at first but fine after 5 minutes.

[wing]

PS...Well you're a Canadian It is to be expected. 8 - P

I think you have me confused with an American

[Snowdog]

No, Some clutches require learning a new biting point. Not all clutches operate the same. That was my original thinking. But I guess not.

I have been following this one closely and I wouldn't blame driver error. This is pretty much a universal reaction. There is something really odd about both the clutch grab and throttle tip in.

I asked because I was surprised NOT to see it in the day one report. It would have been the first time someone DIDN'T complain about the manual.

Since this will be a multi day report it will be interesting to see how tolerable it is after a couple of days.

It is too bad because it has that rare, for a 4cyl manual, tall top gear for quiet low RPM highway cruising (and better highway MPG) that I am looking for.

Most 4cyl MTs seem to be geared as if we don't know how to downshift on the highway.  The Honda fit MT is near 4000RPM (YIKES) at 120km/h.

Anyway I hope the straighten this out by the time the Hatchback arrives, sounds like a nice drivetrain/car otherwise. Do you give direct feedback when you review cars?

[carcrazy]

The clutch sounds pretty bad and it seems like it's not your particular car or you. I wonder, how Kia engineers let such a setup to go into production?

I like the skin of this car, but not sure about what's under; curious to hear. My impression is that it's a pretty car, lots of features, good price, but it sits on a not so good platform.

BTW: Are the door and center armrests padded in this model or are they the same hard-plasctic type as in the sedan?

[stickshift]

I stalled this car a few times, too; same for Paul Williams, so he told me. I just about mastered the clutch/throttle after a week, but it's a very difficult car to drive smoothly. This is a car that can make even an experienced standard driver look like a novice.

[rrocket]

Dude, you make it sound like I have never driven a manual before

I did this, I can ride the clutch all day long and rock the car back and forth.  The throttle tip in is abrupt, so you either burn the thing and ride it through the intersection or you stall because you don't want to do that.  Or you drive like a granny.

Something is a miss as snowdog pointed out, other journalists have reported the same.

EDIT: quick google comes up with carconnection saying:
 We actually recommend the automatic with the Forte, as it works well with the engine, and clutch-throttle coordination on manual cars was frustrating.

Or how about owners taking a month to get use to it? http://www.kia-world.net/forum/showthread.php?tid=1432&page=2

Really usually it takes 2 starts to get use to a clutch.

You're just to used to that one-finger-shift, easy-as-can-be, best-manual-on-the-planet S2000.......

[initial_D]

^^ JB has a Miata now?

Sounds like a decent enuff sporty coupe. Do expect Kia will fix the clutch issues on the next MY vehicles.

[Minou]

Here is my take on the clutch-throttle coordination.  The problem seems to lie with the electronic throttle and engine management of these cars.  When you let go of the clutch pedal to get the friction point before giving gas, if you just let the idle speed fall off below a set value of like 750 RPM, the engine is programmed to stall.  In the past, most engines could be bogged down to say 500 RPM when starting without stalling, but not this one.

This is how I found out my '08 Sonata manual is set up.  And after 2 and a half years and 35000 Km, I still regularly stall it although I've been driving manual transmissions with no problems for more than 25 years.

So you have to give gas first to build revs and then release the clutch, just like an amateur.  If you don't, you stall, especially if the car is completely stopped with the engine warmed up or when starting on an incline.

Maybe Hyundai/Kia should issue a TSB for a software reprogramming for those cars...

[rrocket]

Maybe Hyundai/Kia should issue a TSB for a software reprogramming for those cars...

Maybe they will...since I heard it was an issue on the Genesis and has now been fixed (supposedly).  I also remember Honda having the "RPM hanging" issue between gears which also made for some clunky shifts...